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Author Topic: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)  (Read 8636 times)

Kyzrati

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Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« on: June 07, 2016, 07:00:08 PM »

Here's the place for general spoiler-free feedback and discussion about the most recent releases, if you want to talk about something that you don't feel warrants a dedicated thread.

Alpha 9 release notes and changelog.

If you want to freely talk about spoiler content without the annoyance of spoiler tags, there's a thread for that :D. Note that it's fine to talk about spoilers here as well (if perhaps they're only a small part of what you have to say), just tag them appropriately.
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zxc

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2016, 09:37:26 PM »

Pretty keen to jump right in with this one. I might make the next weekly seed early.

Really curious to see how the flight changes play out. Combined with changes to machines, I think there will be a net increase in ease as well as fun.

By the way, you reference a specific trojan in the changenotes which could be spoilery, maybe?

Nerf to core-analyzers vs behemoths/marauders seems weird. Were people even stacking them? Not sure about that.

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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2016, 09:53:19 PM »

I'm curious, too! More fun would be good :D

I'd say go ahead with a new seed whenever. I'm going to stream this one on Friday night EST now that I'm no longer crunching away on it--have yet to get in a full Alpha 9 run myself.

By the way, you reference a specific trojan in the changenotes which could be spoilery, maybe?
I considered that, but decided it needed to be in the public changelog as a rather significant change, so I at least didn't mention where you use it... (It's also only one of now 22 different unauthorized hacks!)

Nerf to core-analyzers vs behemoths/marauders seems weird. Were people even stacking them?
Certain robots now have more protected cores that are immune to critical destruction (mostly NPCs), and at the same time it felt like Core Analyzers would be a way to somewhat circumvent that core protection and become an optimal way to deal with high-integrity boss-like robots we're starting to see. And shortly before release I wanted to do a little something to make Behemoths more deadly, so in addition to boosting their integrity, I gave them that new protected core characteristic. I still want to revisit Behemoths in more detail depending on how they play now--this time was a quick change in that direction.
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Shobalk

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2016, 10:09:49 PM »

I can not wait to get started on this.  I'm still working through weekly seed #42 Shotty Mayhem.  It's been going on for a while....  four separate trips to the caves!

As soon as I'm done, I'll be digging into this.

Incidentally, if the next seed isn't "Fabulous", you're doing it wrong ;)
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2016, 10:22:10 PM »

I can not wait to get started on this.  I'm still working through weekly seed #42 Shotty Mayhem.  It's been going on for a while....  four separate trips to the caves!
Ha, it's finally possible for a single run to go on for quite some time now that there are so many branch routes ;D

I'm planning to go back and further increase the variety of cave content later on, too, so there's still a chance to occasionally have some more unexpected types of encounters. Also for some of the other maps.
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zxc

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2016, 01:54:05 PM »

Machine changes are sweet as. I've never fabricated so much. The on-map timer and changes to fabrication requirements are just awesome. I also love that the investigation squad dispatched after a detection is announced.

Flight changes seem good. Combined with the machine changes I think flight wins will be more reliable than ever before.

I've been going in a loop where I keep entering the chute, then factory, then the chute, over and over. Gradually I built up items. Perhaps disable the chute traps from spawning on the floor after exiting the wastes. With an excellent combat build I can see massive scores being possible.
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2016, 10:11:27 PM »

Machine changes are sweet as. I've never fabricated so much. The on-map timer and changes to fabrication requirements are just awesome. I also love that the investigation squad dispatched after a detection is announced.
That probably should've been in there earlier ::). All dispatched are now announced, also making it easier for beginners to figure out the consequences of specific actions.

Flight changes seem good. Combined with the machine changes I think flight wins will be more reliable than ever before.
Excellent, reliable is good :). That was the original intent of the system, to fill in those holes and make sure you'd have a way to get something you can't find, especially for specific types of runs.

I've been going in a loop where I keep entering the chute, then factory, then the chute, over and over. Gradually I built up items. Perhaps disable the chute traps from spawning on the floor after exiting the wastes. With an excellent combat build I can see massive scores being possible.
Good points, I do believe chutes will need an adjustment, and that should be the first. I have been waiting for people to take advantage of that, and it's getting easier and easier to do so :P
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zxc

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2016, 10:44:09 PM »

I just finished my first run with Alpha 9.

Code: [Select]
Cogmind - Alpha 9

Name: zzxc

---[ ESCAPED! ]---

 Performance
-------------
Evolutions (9)             4500
Robots Destroyed (35)      175
Value Destroyed (1028)     1028
Prototype IDs (18)         360
Alien Tech Identified (0)  0
Bonus (3000)               3000
              TOTAL SCORE: 9063

 Cogmind
---------
Core Integrity             1462/1600
Matter                     49/300
Energy                     125/300
System Corruption          2%
Temperature                Cool (12)
Location                   Surface

 Parts
-------
Power (3)
  Backup Power III
  Quantum Reactor
Propulsion (6)
  Improved VTOL Module
  Experimental Cesium-ion Thruster
  Experimental Cesium-ion Thruster
  Improved Field Propulsion Drive
Utility (14)
  Advanced Sensor Array
  Improved Signal Interpreter
  Advanced Terrain Scan Processor
  Advanced Transmission Jammer
  Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Improved Hacking Suite
  Improved Hacking Suite
  Experimental Hacking Suite
  Improved System Shield
Weapon (2)
  Micro-nuke Launcher
  Advanced Datajack
Inventory(4)
  Field Propulsion Drive
  EM Disruption Field
  Backup Laser VII

 Peak State
------------
Power
  Backup Power III
  Backup Power VII
  Quantum Reactor
Propulsion
  Improved VTOL Module
  Experimental Cesium-ion Thruster
  Experimental Cesium-ion Thruster
  Field Propulsion Drive
  Improved Field Propulsion Drive
Utility
  Advanced Sensor Array
  Improved Signal Interpreter
  Long-range Terrain Scanner
  Advanced Terrain Scan Processor
  Advanced Transmission Jammer
  Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Insulated Medium Armor
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Improved Hacking Suite
  Improved Hacking Suite
  Experimental Hacking Suite
  Improved System Shield
Weapon
  Backup Laser III
  Advanced Datajack
Inventory
  Field Propulsion Drive
  EM Disruption Field
  Backup Laser VII
  Micro-nuke Launcher
[Rating: 117]

 Favorites
-----------
Power                      Enhanced Nuclear Core
  Engine                   Light Ion Engine
  Power Core               Enhanced Nuclear Core
  Reactor                  Quantum Reactor
Propulsion                 Improved VTOL Module
  Treads                   Medium Treads
  Flight Unit              Improved VTOL Module
Utility                    Hacking Suite
  Device                   Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Processor                Improved Signal Interpreter
  Hackware                 Hacking Suite
  Protection               Improved Medium Armor Plating
Weapon                     Improved Datajack
  Energy Gun               Small Laser
  Ballistic Gun            Assault Rifle
  Ballistic Cannon         Light Cannon
  Launcher                 Heavy Rocket Launcher
  Special Melee Weapon     Improved Datajack

 Stats
-------
Bonus Breakdown            3000
  Win                      3000
Classes Destroyed          6
  Worker                   3
  Builder                  1
  Hauler                   10
  Recycler                 2
  Swarmer                  14
  Grunt                    5
NPCs Destroyed             0
Best Kill Streak           5
  Combat Bots Only         4
Matter Collected           1351
  Salvage Created          1453
Parts Attached             105
  Power                    17
  Propulsion               28
  Utility                  45
  Weapon                   15
Parts Lost                 31
  Power                    9
  Propulsion               3
  Utility                  12
  Weapon                   7
Average Slot Usage (%)     88
  Naked Turns              3
Spaces Moved               9550
  Fastest Speed (%)        434
  Average Speed (%)        333
  Slowest Speed (%)        20
  Overloaded Moves         0
  Propulsion Burnouts      0
  Targets Rammed           0
  Cave-ins Triggered       0
  Teleports                0
Heaviest Build             41
  Greatest Support         89
  Greatest Overweight (x)  10
  Average Overweight (x)   0
Largest Inventory          4
  Most Items Carried       4
  Average Items Carried    3
Core Damage Taken          631
Average Core Remaining (%) 90
  Depth 10 Exit            75
  Depth 9 Exit             100
  Depth 8 Exit             77
  Depth 7 Exit             82
  Depth 6 Exit             96
  Depth 5 Exit             100
  Depth 4 Exit             100
  Depth 3 Exit             93
  Depth 2 Exit             94
  Depth 1 Exit             91
Volleys Fired              82
  Largest                  2
  Hottest                  80
Shots Fired                132
  Gun                      101
  Cannon                   9
  Launcher                 22
  Special                  0
  Kinetic                  57
  Thermal                  53
  Explosive                22
  Electromagnetic          0
  Entropic                 0
Shots Hit Robots           85
  Core Hits                50
Overload Shots             0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Heat Surge               0
  Short Circuit            0
  Meltdown                 0
Melee Attacks              32
  Impact                   0
  Slashing                 0
  Piercing                 0
Damage Inflicted           2478
  Projectiles              749
  Explosions               1729
  Melee                    0
  Ramming                  0
  Kinetic                  475
  Thermal                  367
  Explosive                1586
  Electromagnetic          50
  Impact                   0
  Slashing                 0
  Piercing                 0
  Entropic                 0
Self-Inflicted Damage      0
  Shots                    0
  Rammed                   0
Highest Temperature        335
  Average Temperature      39
  Shutdowns                0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Interference             0
  Matter Decay             0
  Short Circuit            0
  Damage (minor)           0
  Damage (major)           0
  Damage (core)            0
Highest Corruption         6
  Average Corruption       4
  Message Errors           4
  Parts Rejected           0
  Data loss (map)          5
  Data loss (database)     2
  Misfires                 1
  Misdirections            7
  Targeting Errors         0
  Weapon Failures          0
  Depth 2 End              6
  Depth 1 End              2
Haulers Intercepted        10
Robots Corrupted           0
Robots Melted              0
Power Chain Reactions      0
Tactical Retreats          26
Communications Jammed      15
Parts Field Recycled       0
  Retrieved Matter         0
Parts Merge Repaired       0
Drone Launches             2
  Drone Recoveries         0
Derelicts Assembled        0
Traps Triggered            3
  Indirectly               3
Trap Hack Attempts         2
  Triggered                0
  Disarmed                 0
  Reprogrammed             1
  Reused                   0
Machines Disabled          16
Data Cores Recovered       0
  Used                     0
Machines Hacked            76
  Terminals                42
  Fabricators              7
  Repair Stations          11
  Recycling Units          6
  Scanalyzers              5
  Garrison Access          5
Total Hacks                265
  Successful               162
  Failed                   102
  Catastrophic             20
  Database Lockouts        0
  Manual                   42
  Unauthorized             13
  Terminals                139
  Fabricators              33
  Repair Stations          36
  Recycling Units          19
  Scanalyzers              28
  Garrison Access          10
Terminal Hacks             64
  Record                   12
  Part Schematic           3
  Robot Schematic          0
  Robot Analysis           0
  Prototype ID Bank        3
  Open Door                3
  Level Access Points      5
  Branch Access Points     3
  Emergency Access Points  6
  Machine Index            3
  Terminal Index           0
  Fabricator Index         1
  Repair Station Index     0
  Recycling Unit Index     0
  Scanalyzer Index         0
  Garrison Index           0
  Alert Level              2
  Unreport Threat          2
  Locate Traps             7
  Disarm Traps             0
  Reprogram Traps          1
  Dispatch Records         2
  Maintenance Status       2
  Security Status          0
  Surveillance Status      1
  Patrol Status            0
  Transport Status         0
  Investigation Status     0
  Extermination Status     0
  Reinforcement Status     1
  Assault Status           0
  Garrison Status          0
  Intercept Status         0
  Recall Investigation     0
  Recall Extermination     0
  Recall Reinforcements    0
  Recall Assault           0
  Hauler Manifests         0
  Registered Components    3
  Registered Prototypes    1
  Zone Layout              3
  Sector Layout            0
  Machine Controls         0
Hacking Detections         58
  Full Trace Events        14
  Feedback Events          1
  Feedback Corruption      1
  Feedback Part Disabled   0
  Feedback Blocked         0
Trojans Installed          4
  Terminals                4
  Fabricators              0
  Repair Stations          0
  Recycling Units          0
  Scanalyzers              0
  Garrison Access          0
Fabricators Overloaded     0
Garrisons Disabled         4
Garrisons Compromised      0
Fabrication Nework Shutdowns2
Robot Schematics Acquired  0
  Robots Built             0
  Total Robot Build Rating 0
  Robot Fabrication Matter 0
  Robot Fabrication Time   0
Part Schematics Acquired   13
  Parts Built              8
  Total Part Build Rating  29
  Part Fabrication Matter  1508
  Part Fabrication Time    574
Parts Repaired             11
  Part Repair Time         499
Parts Recycled             2
  Recycled Matter          33
  Retrieved Matter         33
  Retrieved Components     3
Parts Scanalyzed           11
  Part Schematics Acquired 10
  Parts Damaged            0
Robot Analysis Total       0
Robots Rewired             0
Robots Hacked              0
  Non-combat               12
  Combat                   0
  Parse                    1
  Link                     0
  Rebooted                 0
  Overloaded               9
  Assimilated              2
  Manual                   0
  Secondary                0
Robot Hack Failures        2
Allies Hacked              0
Hacks Repelled             0
Total Allies               5
  Largest Group            1
  Highest-Rated Group      20
  Highest-Rated Ally       20
Total Orders               3
  STAY                     0
  GOTO                     2
  ROAM                     0
  FOLLOW                   1
  GUARD                    0
  AID                      0
  BUILD                    0
  TUNNEL                   0
  DROP                     0
  PICKUP                   0
  COLLECT                  0
  EXPLORE                  0
  RETURN                   0
Terraforming Orders        0
  Walls Built              0
  Walls Tunneled           0
Ally Attacks               0
  Total Damage             0
  Kills                    0
Allies Corrupted           0
Allies Melted              0
Peak Influence             595
  Average Influence        73
  Final Influence          509
Maximum Alert Level        2
  Low Security (%)         87
  Level 1                  5
  Level 2                  6
  Level 3                  0
  Level 4                  0
  Level 5                  0
Squads Dispatched          22
  Investigation            14
  Extermination            3
  Reinforcement            4
  Assault                  1
  Garrison                 0
  Intercept                0
Derelict Logs Recovered    2
Exploration Rate (%)       20
  Regions Visited          22
  Pre-discovered Areas     0
Garrisons Visited          0
  Relays Disabled          0
  Generators Disabled      0
Network Hubs Disabled      0
Actions Taken              11599
Turns Passed               5332
  Depth 11                 60
  Depth 10                 565
  Depth 9                  57
  Depth 8                  211
  Depth 7                  1231
  Depth 6                  845
  Depth 5                  938
  Depth 4                  588
  Depth 3                  128
  Depth 2                  475
  Depth 1                  234
  Scrapyard                60
  Materials                594
  Factory                  2928
  Research                 603
  Access                   234
  Mines                    66
  Storage                  173
  Waste                    227
  Lower Caves              447

 Prototype IDs
---------------
Heavy Ion Engine
Enhanced Nuclear Core
Light Neutrino Core
Improved Flight Unit
Improved VTOL Module
Experimental Cesium-ion Thruster
Improved Field Propulsion Drive
Experimental Heat Sink
Experimental Optical Array
Advanced Power Amplifier
Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
Quarantine Testbed
Experimental Thermal Shield
Experimental Utility Shielding
Advanced Particle Charger
Experimental Hacking Suite
Advanced Beam Rifle
Improved EM Shotgun

 Fabricated
------------
1x Adv. Sensor Array (-6/Factory)
1x Enh. Nuclear Core (-6/Factory)
1x Adv. Sensor Array (-5/Factory)
1x Imp. Hacking Suite (-4/Factory)
1x Imp. Hacking Suite (-4/Factory)
1x Adv. Sensor Array (-2/Research)
1x Imp. Hacking Suite (-1/Access)
1x Imp. Hacking Suite (-1/Access)

 Alien Tech Recovered
----------------------
None

 Route
-------
-11/Scrapyard
-10/Materials
-10/Mines
-9/Materials
-9/Mines
-8/Materials
-8/Storage
-7/Factory
-7/Waste
-7/Factory (discovered 2 exits: *Low x2)
-7/Lower Caves
-7/Lower Caves
-6/Factory
-6/Waste
-6/Factory (discovered 4 exits: *Fac x4)
-5/Factory
-5/Waste
-5/Factory (discovered 5 exits: *Fac / Upp x2 / Ext x2)
-4/Factory (discovered 3 exits: *Res / Upp x2)
-3/Research (discovered 3 exits: *Res x3)
-2/Research (discovered 3 exits: *Acc x3)
-1/Access
Surface

 Game
------
Seed: 1465745486
^Manual?: 0
Play Time: 166 min
Sessions: 3
Mod: N/A
Game No.: 109
ASCII: 1
Keyboard: 1
Movement: Numpad
Fullscreen: 1
Font: 18/Terminus
Map View: 76x50
FOV Handling: Instant


X=9562305008344427092166476254
952412763151542161247175239453
240731155661202433235052961155
142362444296196266450632194909
692632764479767691066565541151
134922240033551151997251979914
923601134145164792757409255401
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203291145145001101292173609203
695392902164146455467535351412
290265140595961251145471404101
142241241151550146750201136141
241054142142014706113932437765
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613476934046099293447607295329
205620245220215272977996497939
069669443046500550209393661310
3364122452913642

It definitely seems more reliable. Research still threw me in for a loop though. Access was way easier with a dozen pieces of hackware :P
Logged

zxc

  • Cogmind
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  • 1st place in the Best Escapes category during Alpha Challenge 2015 1st place in the High Scores category during Alpha Challenge 2015 Shared a Confirmed Combat Win Shared a Confirmed Stealth Win Kyzrati Patron Bug Hunter Participated in the Alpha Challenge 2015 Achievement leader in at least one category during Alpha Challenge 2015 Wiki Contributor Weekly Seed Participant
  • Posts: 726
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2016, 01:50:30 AM »

Back to back wins. First win streak, maybe? Informal, as uploading scoresheets is optional. I think this is win #14.

Code: [Select]
Cogmind - Alpha 9

Name: zzxc

---[ ESCAPED! ]---

 Performance
-------------
Evolutions (9)             4500
Robots Destroyed (33)      165
Value Destroyed (729)      729
Prototype IDs (5)          100
Alien Tech Identified (0)  0
Bonus (8334)               8334
              TOTAL SCORE: 13828

 Cogmind
---------
Core Integrity             1563/1600
Matter                     290/300
Energy                     118/390
System Corruption          3%
Temperature                Hot (200)
Location                   Surface

 Parts
-------
Power (3)
  Quantum Reactor
  Light Quantum Reactor
Propulsion (5)
  Improved VTOL Module
  Nuclear Pulse Thruster
  Electron Diverter
  Electron Diverter
  Improved Q-Thruster
Utility (15)
  Improved Sensor Array
  Advanced Signal Interpreter
  Advanced ECM Suite
  Improved Transmission Jammer
  Advanced Weight Redist. System
  Advanced Weight Redist. System
  Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Layered Heavy Armor Plating
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Improved Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
Weapon (2)
  Mini Grenade Launcher
  Power Sword
Inventory(4)
  Micro Nuclear Core
  Medium Treads
  Experimental Q-Thruster
  Advanced Signal Interpreter

 Peak State
------------
Power
  Quantum Reactor
  Light Quantum Reactor
Propulsion
  Nuclear Pulse Thruster
  Electron Diverter
  Electron Diverter
  Improved Q-Thruster
  Experimental Q-Thruster
Utility
  Improved Sensor Array
  Advanced Signal Interpreter
  Advanced ECM Suite
  Improved Transmission Jammer
  Advanced Weight Redist. System
  Advanced Weight Redist. System
  Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Layered Heavy Armor Plating
  Improved Utility Shielding
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
Weapon
  Mini Grenade Launcher
  Power Sword
Inventory
  Micro Nuclear Core
  Medium Treads
  Experimental Q-Thruster
  Advanced Signal Interpreter
[Rating: 133]

 Favorites
-----------
Power                      Improved Ion Engine
  Engine                   Improved Ion Engine
  Power Core               Micro Nuclear Core
  Reactor                  Light Quantum Reactor
Propulsion                 Flight Unit
  Treads                   Medium Treads
  Leg                      Aluminum Leg
  Hover Unit               Airjet
  Flight Unit              Flight Unit
Utility                    Advanced Hacking Suite
  Device                   Advanced Weight Redist. System
  Storage                  Small Storage Unit
  Processor                Advanced Signal Interpreter
  Hackware                 Advanced Hacking Suite
  Protection               Improved Utility Shielding
Weapon                     Power Sword
  Ballistic Gun            Assault Rifle
  Launcher                 Mini Grenade Launcher
  Slashing Weapon          Power Sword
  Special Melee Weapon     Improved Datajack

 Stats
-------
Bonus Breakdown            8334
  Win                      3000
  Fast Win                 5334
Classes Destroyed          6
  Hauler                   5
  Recycler                 3
  Watcher                  5
  Swarmer                  14
  Grunt                    4
  Sentry                   2
NPCs Destroyed             0
Best Kill Streak           5
  Combat Bots Only         4
Matter Collected           1275
  Salvage Created          1271
Parts Attached             77
  Power                    15
  Propulsion               23
  Utility                  26
  Weapon                   13
Parts Lost                 16
  Power                    5
  Propulsion               5
  Utility                  4
  Weapon                   2
Average Slot Usage (%)     87
  Naked Turns              2
Spaces Moved               5880
  Fastest Speed (%)        416
  Average Speed (%)        307
  Slowest Speed (%)        62
  Overloaded Moves         0
  Propulsion Burnouts      0
  Targets Rammed           1
  Cave-ins Triggered       0
  Teleports                0
Heaviest Build             60
  Greatest Support         104
  Greatest Overweight (x)  20
  Average Overweight (x)   0
Largest Inventory          6
  Most Items Carried       6
  Average Items Carried    4
Core Damage Taken          513
Average Core Remaining (%) 91
  Depth 10 Exit            86
  Depth 9 Exit             74
  Depth 8 Exit             97
  Depth 7 Exit             91
  Depth 6 Exit             80
  Depth 5 Exit             96
  Depth 4 Exit             94
  Depth 3 Exit             100
  Depth 2 Exit             100
  Depth 1 Exit             97
Volleys Fired              54
  Largest                  2
  Hottest                  50
Shots Fired                92
  Gun                      77
  Cannon                   0
  Launcher                 15
  Special                  0
  Kinetic                  77
  Thermal                  0
  Explosive                15
  Electromagnetic          0
  Entropic                 0
Shots Hit Robots           82
  Core Hits                43
Overload Shots             0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Heat Surge               0
  Short Circuit            0
  Meltdown                 0
Melee Attacks              60
  Impact                   0
  Slashing                 58
  Piercing                 0
Damage Inflicted           2892
  Projectiles              605
  Explosions               884
  Melee                    1401
  Ramming                  2
  Kinetic                  605
  Thermal                  0
  Explosive                884
  Electromagnetic          0
  Impact                   0
  Slashing                 1401
  Piercing                 0
  Entropic                 0
Self-Inflicted Damage      45
  Shots                    2
  Rammed                   1
Highest Temperature        326
  Average Temperature      65
  Shutdowns                0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Interference             0
  Matter Decay             0
  Short Circuit            0
  Damage (minor)           0
  Damage (major)           0
  Damage (core)            0
Highest Corruption         3
  Average Corruption       1
  Message Errors           0
  Parts Rejected           0
  Data loss (map)          0
  Data loss (database)     0
  Misfires                 0
  Misdirections            1
  Targeting Errors         0
  Weapon Failures          0
  Depth 7 End              3
  Depth 2 End              2
  Depth 1 End              3
Haulers Intercepted        5
Robots Corrupted           0
Robots Melted              0
Power Chain Reactions      0
Tactical Retreats          19
Communications Jammed      38
Parts Field Recycled       0
  Retrieved Matter         0
Parts Merge Repaired       0
Drone Launches             0
  Drone Recoveries         0
Derelicts Assembled        0
Traps Triggered            0
  Indirectly               0
Trap Hack Attempts         0
  Triggered                0
  Disarmed                 0
  Reprogrammed             0
  Reused                   0
Machines Disabled          1
Data Cores Recovered       0
  Used                     0
Machines Hacked            48
  Terminals                24
  Fabricators              9
  Repair Stations          4
  Recycling Units          3
  Scanalyzers              3
  Garrison Access          3
Total Hacks                117
  Successful               67
  Failed                   48
  Catastrophic             12
  Database Lockouts        0
  Manual                   33
  Unauthorized             21
  Terminals                59
  Fabricators              17
  Repair Stations          10
  Recycling Units          5
  Scanalyzers              10
  Garrison Access          3
Terminal Hacks             44
  Record                   11
  Part Schematic           2
  Robot Schematic          0
  Robot Analysis           0
  Prototype ID Bank        0
  Open Door                2
  Level Access Points      4
  Branch Access Points     1
  Emergency Access Points  3
  Machine Index            1
  Terminal Index           0
  Fabricator Index         1
  Repair Station Index     1
  Recycling Unit Index     0
  Scanalyzer Index         0
  Garrison Index           0
  Alert Level              0
  Unreport Threat          0
  Locate Traps             4
  Disarm Traps             0
  Reprogram Traps          0
  Dispatch Records         0
  Maintenance Status       0
  Security Status          0
  Surveillance Status      0
  Patrol Status            0
  Transport Status         0
  Investigation Status     0
  Extermination Status     0
  Reinforcement Status     0
  Assault Status           0
  Garrison Status          0
  Intercept Status         0
  Recall Investigation     0
  Recall Extermination     0
  Recall Reinforcements    1
  Recall Assault           0
  Hauler Manifests         0
  Registered Components    0
  Registered Prototypes    0
  Zone Layout              2
  Sector Layout            0
  Machine Controls         0
Hacking Detections         37
  Full Trace Events        8
  Feedback Events          0
  Feedback Corruption      0
  Feedback Part Disabled   0
  Feedback Blocked         0
Trojans Installed          5
  Terminals                5
  Fabricators              0
  Repair Stations          0
  Recycling Units          0
  Scanalyzers              0
  Garrison Access          0
Fabricators Overloaded     0
Garrisons Disabled         3
Garrisons Compromised      0
Fabrication Nework Shutdowns1
Robot Schematics Acquired  0
  Robots Built             0
  Total Robot Build Rating 0
  Robot Fabrication Matter 0
  Robot Fabrication Time   0
Part Schematics Acquired   13
  Parts Built              4
  Total Part Build Rating  12
  Part Fabrication Matter  672
  Part Fabrication Time    262
Parts Repaired             1
  Part Repair Time         16
Parts Recycled             0
  Recycled Matter          2
  Retrieved Matter         2
  Retrieved Components     0
Parts Scanalyzed           2
  Part Schematics Acquired 2
  Parts Damaged            1
Robot Analysis Total       0
Robots Rewired             0
Robots Hacked              0
  Non-combat               1
  Combat                   0
  Parse                    0
  Link                     1
  Rebooted                 0
  Overloaded               0
  Assimilated              0
  Manual                   0
  Secondary                0
Robot Hack Failures        0
Allies Hacked              0
Hacks Repelled             0
Total Allies               3
  Largest Group            2
  Highest-Rated Group      14
  Highest-Rated Ally       7
Total Orders               0
  STAY                     0
  GOTO                     0
  ROAM                     0
  FOLLOW                   0
  GUARD                    0
  AID                      0
  BUILD                    0
  TUNNEL                   0
  DROP                     0
  PICKUP                   0
  COLLECT                  0
  EXPLORE                  0
  RETURN                   0
Terraforming Orders        0
  Walls Built              0
  Walls Tunneled           0
Ally Attacks               0
  Total Damage             0
  Kills                    0
Allies Corrupted           0
Allies Melted              0
Peak Influence             564
  Average Influence        50
  Final Influence          12
Maximum Alert Level        2
  Low Security (%)         94
  Level 1                  3
  Level 2                  1
  Level 3                  0
  Level 4                  0
  Level 5                  0
Squads Dispatched          18
  Investigation            10
  Extermination            4
  Reinforcement            4
  Assault                  0
  Garrison                 0
  Intercept                0
Derelict Logs Recovered    4
Exploration Rate (%)       20
  Regions Visited          13
  Pre-discovered Areas     2
Garrisons Visited          0
  Relays Disabled          0
  Generators Disabled      0
Network Hubs Disabled      0
Actions Taken              6649
Turns Passed               3221
  Depth 11                 68
  Depth 10                 373
  Depth 9                  227
  Depth 8                  146
  Depth 7                  388
  Depth 6                  364
  Depth 5                  234
  Depth 4                  578
  Depth 3                  120
  Depth 2                  377
  Depth 1                  346
  Scrapyard                68
  Materials                746
  Factory                  1136
  Research                 497
  Access                   346
  Upper Caves              428

 Prototype IDs
---------------
Improved VTOL Module
Electron Diverter
Improved Q-Thruster
Experimental Q-Thruster
Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus

 Fabricated
------------
2x Flight Unit (-7/Factory)
1x Adv. Hacking Suite (-5/Factory)
1x Adv. Hacking Suite (-4/Factory)

 Alien Tech Recovered
----------------------
None

 Route
-------
-11/Scrapyard
-10/Materials
-9/Materials
-8/Materials
-7/Factory
-6/Factory (discovered 4 exits: *Fac x4)
-5/Factory
-4/Factory
-4/Upper Caves
-4/Upper Caves (discovered 2 exits: *Res / *War)
-3/Research (discovered 5 exits: *Res x3 / Tes x2)
-2/Research (discovered 3 exits: *Acc x3)
-1/Access
Surface

 Game
------
Seed: 1465798160
^Manual?: 0
Play Time: 92 min
Sessions: 1
Mod: N/A
Game No.: 110
ASCII: 1
Keyboard: 1
Movement: Numpad
Fullscreen: 1
Font: 18/Terminus
Map View: 76x50
FOV Handling: Instant


X=9440168065327222956633215592
526546666693963394962645132126
226346446326996635453943363353
666533515354913659425522545535
332143411592622526694136612624
665646926651954324266125966522
416612192934422466426592562265
645655445666219666661645662642
565669494421656629664964469594
325156666646654466646466532345
566646366666642666666266962925
333445169642635345245461463993
436662943264462664966666646662
666464666624632666645566666432
466664439421539124416326224663
466466646666323556666664666662
646666666119563226943243656563
646596669262322666159232244216
463536225649165661319123995561
426235523911651544319259919269
525494446665191595923532293441
1556641662224424444251567

Machine changes are making it very good for hacking builds. Just look at this:

Note: this is fun. Pls don nerf :D

Upper Caves are very good for flight builds.

Tiny thing that bugged me: I loaded up something to fabricate, then realised I didn't have my last hackware equipped. I exited the fabricator screen and put it on, and opened the fabricator up again. I had to start from scratch. This led to a full trace and other awkwardness. It would be nice if it didn't remove the schematic like that!
« Last Edit: June 13, 2016, 02:03:09 AM by zxc »
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2016, 07:17:52 AM »

Machine changes are making it very good for hacking builds.
That's quite the hacking setup! And you hadn't exactly maxed out on each one either, still using some lower-tier hackware.

Note: this is fun. Pls don nerf :D
This was actually the question that was already going through my mind :P. As long as it's still fun (and fairly challenging!) then it's mostly good as is. I did have a great bit of fun with my latest run with excellent hacking bonuses, with all those new strategic options opening up, but I was also doing combat so eventually got in over my head...

Tiny thing that bugged me: I loaded up something to fabricate, then realised I didn't have my last hackware equipped. I exited the fabricator screen and put it on, and opened the fabricator up again. I had to start from scratch. This led to a full trace and other awkwardness. It would be nice if it didn't remove the schematic like that!
I can see keeping the schematic loaded until fabrication is actually started. I'll see about making it happen (might be a good bit of work since there's no precedent for that sort of behavior in the system).
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Decker

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2016, 07:31:12 AM »

Quote
This was actually the question that was already going through my mind :P. As long as it's still fun (and fairly challenging!) then it's mostly good as is. I did have a great bit of fun with my latest run with excellent hacking bonuses, with all those new strategic options opening up, but I was also doing combat so eventually got in over my head...

One thing to consider: you still have to find those chute traps repeatedly. It's not always easy. Perhaps it gets easier with an allied operator.

As for using chutes to build big scores, I did do that sometimes, but really, just going through the Wastes once is enough. There's no need to reset the alert when the AI is doing you a favor by feeding the slaughterhouse at alert level 5.

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Happylisk

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2016, 07:39:33 AM »

Also, I suspect these fabrication changes will be most useful for stealthy builds and less useful for combat heavy ones.  I'm sure certain endings for the game will require a beefy build and will be inaccessible to stealthy hackers, so that's a balancing factor too. 
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2016, 08:20:55 AM »

Haha, feeding the slaughterhouse, a.k.a. Decker.

One thing to consider: you still have to find those chute traps repeatedly. It's not always easy. Perhaps it gets easier with an allied operator.
True, though I still think it's better to break the potential for a near-infinite chain.

Also, I suspect these fabrication changes will be most useful for stealthy builds and less useful for combat heavy ones.  I'm sure certain endings for the game will require a beefy build and will be inaccessible to stealthy hackers, so that's a balancing factor too. 
Correct (I think :P--we're not there yet so I don't have the details, but the idea is that some endings will be pretty tough for non-combat builds since you'll have to face some challenges rather directly. With guns ;) That's not to stop a stealth runner from migrating to a different loadout, but doing so can sometimes be tough to do. That said, there might be some places in the late game where it's more feasible to do that, say... in a branch.)
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zxc

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2016, 10:21:49 PM »

Another win which happened to have a lot of chute-ing.

Code: [Select]
Cogmind - Alpha 9

Name: zzxc

---[ ESCAPED! ]---

 Performance
-------------
Evolutions (9)             4500
Robots Destroyed (34)      170
Value Destroyed (943)      943
Prototype IDs (26)         520
Alien Tech Identified (0)  0
Bonus (4281)               4281
              TOTAL SCORE: 10414

 Cogmind
---------
Core Integrity             1600/1600
Matter                     300/300
Energy                     522/525
System Corruption          1%
Temperature                Cool (3)
Location                   Surface

 Parts
-------
Power (3)
  Improved Ion Engine
  Micro Fission Core
  Heavy Anti-Matter Reactor
Propulsion (6)
  High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
  Improved VTOL Module
  Field Propulsion Array
  Improved Diametric Drive
Utility (14)
  Advanced Visual Processing Unit
  Enhanced Optical Array
  Experimental Signal Interpreter
  Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Reflective Heavy Armor
  Improved Utility Shielding
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  System Shield
  System Shield
  Advanced System Shield
Weapon (2)
  Nova Cannon
  Advanced Datajack
Inventory(4)
  Nuclear Pulse Thruster
  Experimental Cooling System
  Smartbomb Launcher

 Peak State
------------
Power
  Improved Ion Engine
  Micro Fission Core
  Heavy Anti-Matter Reactor
Propulsion
  High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
  Improved VTOL Module
  Field Propulsion Array
  Improved Diametric Drive
Utility
  Advanced Visual Processing Unit
  Enhanced Optical Array
  Experimental Signal Interpreter
  Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
  Reflective Heavy Armor
  Improved Utility Shielding
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Hacking Suite
  Advanced Hacking Suite
  System Shield
  System Shield
  Advanced System Shield
Weapon
  Nova Cannon
  Advanced Datajack
Inventory
  Nuclear Pulse Thruster
  Experimental Cooling System
  Smartbomb Launcher
[Rating: 137]

 Favorites
-----------
Power                      Light Nuclear Core
  Engine                   Light Ion Engine
  Power Core               Light Nuclear Core
  Reactor                  Heavy Anti-Matter Reactor
Propulsion                 Improved VTOL Module
  Treads                   Durable Medium Treads
  Leg                      Aluminum Leg
  Flight Unit              Improved VTOL Module
Utility                    Hacking Suite
  Device                   Improved Sensor Array
  Storage                  Medium Storage Unit
  Processor                Enhanced Optical Array
  Hackware                 Hacking Suite
  Protection               Core Shielding
Weapon                     Advanced Datajack
  Energy Gun               Small Laser
  Energy Cannon            Nova Cannon
  Ballistic Gun            Assault Rifle
  Ballistic Cannon         Light Cannon
  Launcher                 Compact Tesla Bomb Launcher
  Impact Weapon            Great Maul
  Slashing Weapon          Falx
  Special Melee Weapon     Advanced Datajack

 Stats
-------
Bonus Breakdown            4281
  Win                      3000
  Fast Win                 1281
Classes Destroyed          9
  Tunneler                 1
  Hauler                   5
  Recycler                 6
  Operator                 1
  Watcher                  5
  Swarmer                  4
  Grunt                    7
  Sentry                   3
  Programmer               2
NPCs Destroyed             0
Best Kill Streak           4
  Combat Bots Only         3
Matter Collected           1713
  Salvage Created          1667
Parts Attached             115
  Power                    23
  Propulsion               25
  Utility                  48
  Weapon                   19
Parts Lost                 24
  Power                    9
  Propulsion               7
  Utility                  6
  Weapon                   2
Average Slot Usage (%)     91
  Naked Turns              1
Spaces Moved               7317
  Fastest Speed (%)        400
  Average Speed (%)        331
  Slowest Speed (%)        40
  Overloaded Moves         0
  Propulsion Burnouts      0
  Targets Rammed           0
  Cave-ins Triggered       0
  Teleports                0
Heaviest Build             51
  Greatest Support         97
  Greatest Overweight (x)  5
  Average Overweight (x)   0
Largest Inventory          10
  Most Items Carried       10
  Average Items Carried    3
Core Damage Taken          776
Average Core Remaining (%) 90
  Depth 10 Exit            96
  Depth 9 Exit             94
  Depth 8 Exit             79
  Depth 7 Exit             97
  Depth 6 Exit             100
  Depth 5 Exit             63
  Depth 4 Exit             96
  Depth 3 Exit             94
  Depth 2 Exit             90
  Depth 1 Exit             100
Volleys Fired              126
  Largest                  2
  Hottest                  113
Shots Fired                190
  Gun                      84
  Cannon                   101
  Launcher                 5
  Special                  0
  Kinetic                  131
  Thermal                  54
  Explosive                0
  Electromagnetic          5
  Entropic                 0
Shots Hit Robots           118
  Core Hits                48
Overload Shots             0
  Energy Bleed             0
  Heat Surge               0
  Short Circuit            0
  Meltdown                 0
Melee Attacks              60
  Impact                   14
  Slashing                 40
  Piercing                 0
Damage Inflicted           3276
  Projectiles              1961
  Explosions               61
  Melee                    1254
  Ramming                  0
  Kinetic                  1213
  Thermal                  748
  Explosive                0
  Electromagnetic          61
  Impact                   224
  Slashing                 1030
  Piercing                 0
  Entropic                 0
Self-Inflicted Damage      28
  Shots                    3
  Rammed                   0
Highest Temperature        246
  Average Temperature      47
  Shutdowns                0
  Energy Bleed             1
  Interference             0
  Matter Decay             0
  Short Circuit            0
  Damage (minor)           0
  Damage (major)           0
  Damage (core)            0
Highest Corruption         8
  Average Corruption       3
  Message Errors           0
  Parts Rejected           0
  Data loss (map)          0
  Data loss (database)     0
  Misfires                 0
  Misdirections            0
  Targeting Errors         1
  Weapon Failures          0
  Depth 8 End              1
  Depth 3 End              2
  Depth 2 End              8
  Depth 1 End              1
Haulers Intercepted        5
Robots Corrupted           0
Robots Melted              0
Power Chain Reactions      0
Tactical Retreats          20
Communications Jammed      54
Parts Field Recycled       0
  Retrieved Matter         0
Parts Merge Repaired       0
Drone Launches             2
  Drone Recoveries         0
Derelicts Assembled        0
Traps Triggered            0
  Indirectly               0
Trap Hack Attempts         0
  Triggered                0
  Disarmed                 0
  Reprogrammed             0
  Reused                   0
Machines Disabled          3
Data Cores Recovered       1
  Used                     0
Machines Hacked            58
  Terminals                40
  Fabricators              1
  Repair Stations          5
  Recycling Units          5
  Scanalyzers              4
  Garrison Access          3
Total Hacks                226
  Successful               95
  Failed                   131
  Catastrophic             31
  Database Lockouts        0
  Manual                   64
  Unauthorized             16
  Terminals                164
  Fabricators              5
  Repair Stations          18
  Recycling Units          18
  Scanalyzers              15
  Garrison Access          6
Terminal Hacks             58
  Record                   8
  Part Schematic           6
  Robot Schematic          0
  Robot Analysis           1
  Prototype ID Bank        5
  Open Door                3
  Level Access Points      5
  Branch Access Points     4
  Emergency Access Points  8
  Machine Index            2
  Terminal Index           0
  Fabricator Index         0
  Repair Station Index     0
  Recycling Unit Index     0
  Scanalyzer Index         0
  Garrison Index           0
  Alert Level              0
  Unreport Threat          0
  Locate Traps             9
  Disarm Traps             2
  Reprogram Traps          0
  Dispatch Records         0
  Maintenance Status       0
  Security Status          0
  Surveillance Status      0
  Patrol Status            0
  Transport Status         0
  Investigation Status     0
  Extermination Status     0
  Reinforcement Status     0
  Assault Status           0
  Garrison Status          0
  Intercept Status         0
  Recall Investigation     0
  Recall Extermination     0
  Recall Reinforcements    1
  Recall Assault           0
  Hauler Manifests         0
  Registered Components    0
  Registered Prototypes    0
  Zone Layout              4
  Sector Layout            0
  Machine Controls         0
Hacking Detections         45
  Full Trace Events        7
  Feedback Events          1
  Feedback Corruption      1
  Feedback Part Disabled   0
  Feedback Blocked         0
Trojans Installed          7
  Terminals                7
  Fabricators              0
  Repair Stations          0
  Recycling Units          0
  Scanalyzers              0
  Garrison Access          0
Fabricators Overloaded     0
Garrisons Disabled         3
Garrisons Compromised      0
Fabrication Nework Shutdowns1
Robot Schematics Acquired  0
  Robots Built             0
  Total Robot Build Rating 0
  Robot Fabrication Matter 0
  Robot Fabrication Time   0
Part Schematics Acquired   6
  Parts Built              1
  Total Part Build Rating  5
  Part Fabrication Matter  190
  Part Fabrication Time    31
Parts Repaired             4
  Part Repair Time         376
Parts Recycled             0
  Recycled Matter          13
  Retrieved Matter         13
  Retrieved Components     3
Parts Scanalyzed           3
  Part Schematics Acquired 2
  Parts Damaged            0
Robot Analysis Total       1
Robots Rewired             0
Robots Hacked              0
  Non-combat               3
  Combat                   0
  Parse                    0
  Link                     0
  Rebooted                 0
  Overloaded               3
  Assimilated              0
  Manual                   0
  Secondary                0
Robot Hack Failures        0
Allies Hacked              0
Hacks Repelled             0
Total Allies               2
  Largest Group            2
  Highest-Rated Group      10
  Highest-Rated Ally       5
Total Orders               2
  STAY                     0
  GOTO                     0
  ROAM                     0
  FOLLOW                   0
  GUARD                    0
  AID                      0
  BUILD                    0
  TUNNEL                   0
  DROP                     0
  PICKUP                   0
  COLLECT                  0
  EXPLORE                  2
  RETURN                   0
Terraforming Orders        0
  Walls Built              0
  Walls Tunneled           0
Ally Attacks               0
  Total Damage             0
  Kills                    0
Allies Corrupted           0
Allies Melted              0
Peak Influence             505
  Average Influence        57
  Final Influence          113
Maximum Alert Level        2
  Low Security (%)         90
  Level 1                  6
  Level 2                  3
  Level 3                  0
  Level 4                  0
  Level 5                  0
Squads Dispatched          19
  Investigation            8
  Extermination            2
  Reinforcement            9
  Assault                  0
  Garrison                 0
  Intercept                0
Derelict Logs Recovered    2
Exploration Rate (%)       18
  Regions Visited          20
  Pre-discovered Areas     0
Garrisons Visited          0
  Relays Disabled          0
  Generators Disabled      0
Network Hubs Disabled      0
Actions Taken              8920
Turns Passed               4572
  Depth 11                 80
  Depth 10                 285
  Depth 9                  229
  Depth 8                  467
  Depth 7                  384
  Depth 6                  58
  Depth 5                  1227
  Depth 4                  477
  Depth 3                  717
  Depth 2                  439
  Depth 1                  209
  Scrapyard                80
  Materials                852
  Factory                  1733
  Research                 1156
  Access                   209
  Storage                  129
  Waste                    149
  Upper Caves              264

 Prototype IDs
---------------
Light Neutrino Core
Heavy Anti-Matter Reactor
High-density Centrium Heavy Treads
Improved VTOL Module
Improved Diametric Drive
Experimental Heat Sink
Experimental Cooling System
Experimental Signal Interpreter
Experimental Terrain Scan Processor
Gravity Neutralizing Apparatus
Experimental Focal Shield
Beam Splitter
EM Dispersion Field
Experimental Reclamation Unit
Experimental Cloaking Device
System Purifier
Improved Medium Laser
Cooled Phase Gun
Improved EM Shotgun
Advanced Beam Cannon
Cooled Phase Cannon
Improved Assault Rifle
Tactical Quantum Warhead
Tesla Bomb Launcher
Compact Tesla Bomb Launcher
Enhanced Gamma Bomb Array

 Fabricated
------------
1x Adv. Hacking Suite (-2/Research)

 Alien Tech Recovered
----------------------
None

 Route
-------
-11/Scrapyard
-10/Materials
-9/Materials (discovered 3 exits: *Mat x3)
-8/Materials
-8/Storage
-7/Factory (discovered 4 exits: *Fac x4)
-6/Factory
-5/Factory
-5/Waste
-5/Factory (discovered 2 exits: Upp x2)
-5/Waste
-5/Factory (discovered 2 exits: Upp x2)
-5/Waste
-5/Factory (discovered 4 exits: *Fac x4)
-4/Factory (discovered 4 exits: *Upp x2 / Ext x2)
-4/Upper Caves
-4/Upper Caves
-3/Research (discovered 6 exits: *Res x3 / Arm / *Tes x2)
-2/Research
-1/Access
Surface

 Game
------
Seed: 1465915163
^Manual?: 0
Play Time: 109 min
Sessions: 1
Mod: N/A
Game No.: 116
ASCII: 1
Keyboard: 1
Movement: Numpad
Fullscreen: 1
Font: 18/Terminus
Map View: 76x50
FOV Handling: Instant


X=9538381037351766648826188649
629584588885116561156141288168
898868885525419961656168661168
881511614254669516918121228154
545441165658256158998618991698
888821664858189882681882616116
868268842946246696811891525159
118141814869146828191668888868
166819562182121144681559821881
556199888569866248818898881918
858858119541114818554618858898
888819154148144625526459141886
121284111154281188149481588818
858698888898888818851818868884
811818858818898198888254118956
982869199998158918889898888591
885818888898885818858818484481
195611269916848151526881518581
888815586489118811514654616281
912246415588688985852965586181
451896118251615618652619119866
911868244459446542666654669299
519622614122818615129115182485

Kind of surprised this one managed it.

I looked back and realised that my two win streak was actually a three win streak continuing off the pacifist win. It's too bad I decided to experiment with hover and combat next which didn't work out so well.

I feel like exploring the branches now and getting to know the lore better. All of my Alpha 9 games have had a lot of record hacks but I'm still in the dark as to what is going on.
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #14 on: June 15, 2016, 07:03:13 AM »

Hehe, zxc is generally like "hey I'm outta here you guys do what you want..."

Quite a looping route in -5! And I see you build more hackware :)

Why'd you decide not to go all the way out in -4?
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Josh Ge, Developer - Dev Blog | @GridSageGames | Patreon

zxc

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  • 1st place in the Best Escapes category during Alpha Challenge 2015 1st place in the High Scores category during Alpha Challenge 2015 Shared a Confirmed Combat Win Shared a Confirmed Stealth Win Kyzrati Patron Bug Hunter Participated in the Alpha Challenge 2015 Achievement leader in at least one category during Alpha Challenge 2015 Wiki Contributor Weekly Seed Participant
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2016, 07:13:31 AM »

Building hackware is the way to go! Actually, that one cost me an adv. sensor array and other trouble. I haven't been fabricating a huge amount (I do when I have the right opportunity) but I'm still finding it easier than ever before to churn out wins. Not sure why. Maybe that small amount of reliable fabrication is making all the difference? Or the swarmer/programmer speed nerf... Or the flight unit changes? I still think the flight units aren't quite right, as they don't really get faster from what I've seen but they require much more energy/heat maintenance. IMO heat/energy cost should be almost directly associated with increased speed. Mass support is less important I find, and most of the flight units I find are in the same ballpark.

All the way out? Not sure what you mean. I like the upper caves because they are safe to navigate with flight + sensors + optics, and they
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

edit: Addition of caves certainly helps. Also, chute traps seem to be so common in factory that I just pop in when I'm in an uncomfortable situation. The only problem is it can take forever to trigger them with flight.

edit2: I think the difference is I've had a lot of hackware during my last few wins. Fabrication played some part in that, and it's also a positive feedback loop to getting more hackware. Research and Access are extremely difficult without hacking the location of the exit, and I'm still not really a fan of terrain scanners (they're nice but I'd rather have solid sensors/interpreters and use hacking and manual exploration to work out my surroundings).
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 07:22:07 AM by zxc »
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Kyzrati

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #16 on: June 15, 2016, 07:35:00 AM »

Fabricating just one or two extra vital parts will can pick up significant slack, I'm sure. I don't think the enemy speed adjustments would make much of a difference.

And it's true that flight units generally don't get much faster individually; they're instead balanced so that you get extra support (which approximately quadruples on average by the end of the game) for the same speed. The way to get faster is to attach more of them. This has always made more sense to me since otherwise it would be impossible to both fly and have the choice of carrying some of the late-game good stuff, or better armor.

It's a tough call, though maybe there could be two different varieties of flight units, one with better support, and one with worse support but better speed? Adding the latter would mean you could get an even faster build with fewer propulsion slots that might have to just stick to nothing but sensors and light everything, like you sometimes do. But then it would also divide the supply of flight units into two categories and possibly increase the difficulty of maintaining either build...

All the way out? Not sure what you mean.
Sorry, all the way "out" meaning "outward"--you'd already reached the second cave area but didn't want to head for the end of the branch.

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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #17 on: June 15, 2016, 07:50:15 AM »

Fabricating just one or two extra vital parts will can pick up significant slack, I'm sure. I don't think the enemy speed adjustments would make much of a difference.
Agreed here.

And it's true that flight units generally don't get much faster individually; they're instead balanced so that you get extra support (which approximately quadruples on average by the end of the game) for the same speed. The way to get faster is to attach more of them. This has always made more sense to me since otherwise it would be impossible to both fly and have the choice of carrying some of the late-game good stuff, or better armor.
Agreed here too. However, while the speed doesn't increase on individual units, the maintenance costs do. This makes lower tier units better for stacking to improve speed.

It's a tough call, though maybe there could be two different varieties of flight units, one with better support, and one with worse support but better speed? Adding the latter would mean you could get an even faster build with fewer propulsion slots that might have to just stick to nothing but sensors and light everything, like you sometimes do. But then it would also divide the supply of flight units into two categories and possibly increase the difficulty of maintaining either build...
Indeed, I dunno.

All the way out? Not sure what you mean.
Sorry, all the way "out" meaning "outward"--you'd already reached the second cave area but didn't want to head for the end of the branch.
I haven't done a great deal of exploration.
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edit: What if all flight units had the same maintenance costs and simply improved on other stats as you found better units? This was the change I thought you were making when you announced changes to flight.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 07:52:23 AM by zxc »
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #18 on: June 15, 2016, 08:09:49 AM »

This makes lower tier units better for stacking to improve speed.
Good point, an observation with interesting implications... Technically high-tier flight can still stack speed fairly well, since with the extra support you can afford a heavier/better cooling system, for example, though that's not even necessary if you're traveling light in the first place, where low-tier will apparently do.

I need to trigger the trap pronto.
Okay, well, don't worry about it since in Alpha 10 I'll add your dive key for you ;)

edit: What if all flight units had the same maintenance costs and simply improved on other stats as you found better units? This was the change I thought you were making when you announced changes to flight.
Well I mostly did that, by dropping all movement costs to the same values, because the biggest culprits making high-tier flight inordinately difficult to maintain (to the point of not being worth it) were those costs, since they would stack to ridiculous heights as you moved faster, up to 10-15 times per turn.

By maintenance I assume you mean upkeep, and those were left in because by the latter half of the game they only range from 2-3 instead of 1-2, a rather minor price to pay considering they'll give you 2x/3x/4x as much support, and you can use a small portion of that support to cover the costs incurred.

It's still possible to lower the upkeep a little bit, though the changes elsewhere were already quite drastic. If you compare overall energy/heat movement now to what it was before, it's gone down by a huge margin. I would think this is a strong contributing factor to flight being more reliable now, since you have to wait around to recover energy or dissipate heat less often, no?
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2016, 08:23:03 AM »

I've got to say, the energy / heat costs (or upkeep, or maintenance) are a lot smaller now, certainly. Of course, overall speeds are also slower, which contribute as well. Perhaps it's the combination of fabrication + flight changes + caves which are resulting in an easier time for my style of play, then.
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #20 on: June 15, 2016, 10:30:47 AM »

I would second the addition for the dive key for chute traps. I also agree with zxc on not letting chutes on the same level after you return to it from wastes. This can lead to a significant abuse of the fab system.

The main path to victory via complex has become significantly easier. As zxc pointed out, once you get the hackware snowball rolling, it's not that hard. Fabricate a bunch of sensors and you are good to go. The game feels completely different when you can reliably locate the exits. I felt like I could have won quite a few times, but I have been trying very hard to hit both data-miner and warlord in order to do the god-mode thingy. On an average, finding both of them involves hitting and exploring 3 full cave branches. Not so good for speed builds as you can run into some unavoidable nasty situations (such as spawning in front of a behemoth). Especially in lower caves. It can get rough down there as I usually don't have good sensors at that point.

Fabrication is in a good place now. I am curious to see how combat runs exploit fabrication. I think fabrication is worth it only when it is used to obtain something that provides long term value. Speed builds usually consist of very high quality, high impact parts like sensor arrays or fancy hackware that lasts into the late game. Combat builds are known for their churn rate. I wonder what they would fabricate? Launchers?

edit: Re high/mid-tier flight units: I actually prefer them to low tier ones despite their maintenance. The problem with low-tier ones is that they are made of paper and can be one-shotted away by many things. Propulsion is going to take the brunt of any incoming damage as speed builds are usually processor heavy.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 11:01:48 AM by Sherlockkat »
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #21 on: June 15, 2016, 11:07:36 AM »

Combat builds are known for their churn rate. I wonder what they would fabricate? Launchers?
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #22 on: June 15, 2016, 11:11:06 AM »

You have a point about integrity. That is usually how I wind up with lategame flight units - the better earlygame ones get blown off :P

edit: However, in all seriousness, the lategame flight units certainly are better than the earlygame ones. But there is an odd time in the game where new flight units jump up in maintenance costs for almost no gain. That is when I tend to notice the values.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 11:13:22 AM by zxc »
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #23 on: June 15, 2016, 11:20:36 AM »

I actually start migrating to better power cores pre-emptively in caves. This is to deal with the increasingly power hungry nature of the flight units. The samaritans run around with neutrino cores which are quite good. Also, hitting Zhirov should solve one of our two problems for good, either heat or power.

edit: I must say I haven't paid close attention the flight unit stats when it comes to upkeep. I usually pick up any good reactor in sight and assume that they will cover my flight costs later :p.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 11:23:48 AM by Sherlockkat »
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Re: Alpha 9 Discussion/Feedback (spoiler-free)
« Reply #24 on: June 15, 2016, 11:21:57 AM »

@zxc: Hehe.

Yeah, the jump is difficult to avoid for the same reason movement costs scaled too strongly earlier (and is also the reason I ended up going with a flat rate for movement rather than even a 1-point increase at some point)--too few values available without going to fractions (or changing the whole unit of upkeep, which would be too confusing).

The only way around it is to flatten upkeep as well, which I was considering but again wanted to see how the existing changes played out. Feels like it would be too effective if even the only once-per-turn costs were reduced. I like the idea of having to more closely manage resources as a flier, and that element would be essentially removed in the late game if it were changed further.
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